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Thread: Custom Thorens TD150 Sole

  1. #41
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    Glad to understand you like it Robert, but would you please expand on the improvements and explain what you find is better with the Ai arm board over your earlier boards for the benefit of peeps.


    Regards.

    John R

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    Well the new aluminium/MDF/aluminium arm board with Sole Subchassis from John has taken my TD150 to something very special.It makes set up much easier being the arm board prefectly flat and straight.Tracking has improved , noise floor is much lower I'm hearing much more detail in the highs are cleaner midrange and female voices just are right on and bass is tighter and deeper even at low volume everything just sound more real.Being that what we want from ours recorded music, playback that is like a real gig.I mostly listen underground Rock Punk,garage, 60's I like to listen very high volume with the new arm board the can go higher without any problems.

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  3. #43
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    Excellent news Robert. Really glad to learn you're happy with our arm board upgrade..

    Just relax and you'll hear far more again - lose yourself in the performance m8 and report back once more.


    Regards.

    John R.

  4. #44
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    With the new AI arm board Roksan Nima tone arm and Denon DL-S1 LOMC my TD150 is something very special.The detail I now hear is best I have ever heard from my system. Even with Lo-fi punk rock recordings the music just come at you like it's live.It's like I'm going deeper into the music hearing more than I did before.All I know is that more people with TD150 and TD160 should get John to make Sole's for thorens, they to will have killer turntable.
    Robert
    SE LP12/Sole SubChassisVIII/SSP12/Hercules-Mober DC&PSU/Roksan NimaUnipivot+sKale/ZYX R50 Bloom L/Whest PS30R /CambridgeAudio Azur 851A/MerlinTSM/Mytek St192DACTascamDA-3000

  5. #45
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    Thanks Robert.

    I'm reluctant to start producing batches of TD 150 and 160 chassis because I'm still not convinced there's a viable market. I understand there are many more Thorens TT's than LP12's out there, but until I start geing the requests I simply don't see the market - even though we both know what a modified TD 150 / 160 is capable of.

    You need to start saving up for j7's new unipivot now m8 !

    Regards

    John R

  6. #46
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    John,
    I wish I could get more thorens owner to see how much improvement they could have wiith a Sole sub chassis and arm board I know that you can't start make Sole's without a market .I'll do what I can but you know that people here and other forums are a hard nut to crack.Maybe one day they will listen

    You need to start saving up for j7's new unipivot now m8 !
    One day, if I can save $100 a month for year half I could do it.For now I'm happy with the Roksan Nima
    Robert
    SE LP12/Sole SubChassisVIII/SSP12/Hercules-Mober DC&PSU/Roksan NimaUnipivot+sKale/ZYX R50 Bloom L/Whest PS30R /CambridgeAudio Azur 851A/MerlinTSM/Mytek St192DACTascamDA-3000

  7. #47
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    Hey John,
    I wanted to show you how my TD150 is now. I had a top plate with 1.9mm stainless steel with Linn motor mount so I could use the new Hercules Mober DC motor and power supply.It's a big improvement in sq over the Ac Mose/Hercules psu with Linn 24 pole motor had been using.
    Also new plinth made like LP12 but to TD150 size . Got a trampolin 2 at cost had to modify for it to fit the plinth .I'm very happy with what I have made with your and others help a turntable that is as good as what Linn sells for over$15000.00 and I may have spend $3000+. Oh the sub platter is from thorens Ambiance.

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    SE LP12/Sole SubChassisVIII/SSP12/Hercules-Mober DC&PSU/Roksan NimaUnipivot+sKale/ZYX R50 Bloom L/Whest PS30R /CambridgeAudio Azur 851A/MerlinTSM/Mytek St192DACTascamDA-3000

  8. #48
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    Hi Robert.

    Well, it has been an interesting project over a period of time you've virtually converted it into an LP12 and with many third party components! Or perhaps it is a case of taking the LP12 back to its roots by making the TD150 into what it could have/should have been from day one?

    The maple plinth is very nice as is the inner platter and Mober components. Who made the plinth for you? It's all looking beautiful - well done indeed!


    You see Robert what Ivor Tiefenbrun did in the early 1970's was simple - he took the AR/Ariston/ Thorens concept and simply included a hardwood plinth which gave the LP12 much visual appeal, underneath its new clothes nothing else was any better than those 3 TT's I mentioned.

    In actual fact the other components were nothing special. He then very cleverly and quite forcefully created and perpetuated a myth - which unfortunately runs to this day and many are still caught in the headlights and under his influence. Purchasing an LP12 had eluded me for many years as I was taken in by all the UK press wrote about the LP12 Of course when I finally got hold of one I was bloody appalled at the poor quality of the guts of the thing and my story began. I have sought to offer improvement on he early LP12 by purchasing and l analysing and listening to the performance of many other manufacturers tables - DD, belt & idlers and solid decks, spring decks - all manner in fact. I'm trying capture the best of each with my components. Your journey has been fascinating to watch too!


    I have new chassis suspension/isolation components under development currently and there's a Gentleman in Australia developing a new hi torque AC power supply which I'm also very interested in and which is showing great promise.. Andy R of pfm and the Linn forums, which incidentally I've covertly been banned from (so more Linn untruth) has a protoype in use and he's very impressed with it. Seems as if the great AD/DC argument is still apace.

    Interesting times!


    Bet wishes and kind regards

    John
    Last edited by John R; 28th May 2016 at 09:48.

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by John R View Post
    You see Robert what Ivor Tiefenbrun did in the early 1970's was simple - he took the Ariston RD11 parts, changed the name and passed it off as his own design, 2 years after the RD11 was first launched.

    Quote Originally Posted by John R View Post
    You see Robert what Hamish Robertson did in the early 1970's was simple - he took the AR/Thorens design and made his own version, and launched in 1971 two years before Linn as a company even existed

    I've corrected it for you John. Either one of the above are more factual. The only Tiefenbrun to have his name on any of the design was Jack (Ivor's dad) who had an application patent retrospectively granted for ye bearing tip only.

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    Thanks Paul, either way I guess the truth hurts! I wonder did Thorens "borrow" that bearing tip concept as I have a TD160 bearing here which looks much better made and finished that Linn's although the angle of the spindle tip differs significantly.

  11. #51

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    Hi John
    I think the bearing of the LP12 is one of the few parts that really can't be criticised,other parts certainly can,if only for the prices charged for some of them!I always thought the td150 bearing to be a good one considering it's cost originally, using iolites/phosphor bronze bushes seems a better idea to me than the various plastics linn have used
    I often wonder if the LP12 is as temperamental to set up as some dealers and users would want you to think then how does using records of differing weights affect it,after all using a 180g album must have some effect on the so exacting set up of the suspension compared to some of the wafer thin albums from the 70's and 80's!
    I was banned from the linn forum for calling a guy who is a prick a prick lol,I seemed to have started the ball rolling for them getting rid of members who didn't swallow all the linn bs hook line and sinker!
    Last edited by steve195527; 28th May 2016 at 20:33.

  12. #52
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    Has anyone thought of adding a hook, line and sinker to the LP12? Might improve it.

  13. #53
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    The maple plinth is very nice as is the inner platter and Mober components. Who made the plinth for you? It's all looking beautiful - well done indeed!
    John, The plinth was made by Russ Collinson layers-of-beauty.co.uk for a very fair price and great build to.
    Robert
    SE LP12/Sole SubChassisVIII/SSP12/Hercules-Mober DC&PSU/Roksan NimaUnipivot+sKale/ZYX R50 Bloom L/Whest PS30R /CambridgeAudio Azur 851A/MerlinTSM/Mytek St192DACTascamDA-3000

  14. #54

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    doesn't he make the plinths for one of the companies that offer upgrades etc for the lp12?they aren't sold through the linn dealer network so hence are disliked/slagged off by them as being "not up to standard":-what they forget is that linn over the years have used various companies to supply the "original linn" plinths,and my guess is that as long as the quality was acceptable the over riding criteria for which company got the contract was price that linn paid for them

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    Quote Originally Posted by rkay5 View Post
    John, The plinth was made by Russ Collinson layers-of-beauty.co.uk for a very fair price and great build to.
    Thanks for that Robert, I thought that may have been the case - Russ is an excellent craftsman, I know this first hand as he has built me a Lenco plinth.

    Quote Originally Posted by steve195527 View Post
    doesn't he make the plinths for one of the companies that offer upgrades etc for the lp12?they aren't sold through the linn dealer network so hence are disliked/slagged off by them as being "not up to standard":-what they forget is that linn over the years have used various companies to supply the "original linn" plinths,and my guess is that as long as the quality was acceptable the over riding criteria for which company got the contract was price that linn paid for them

    He certainly does Steve. Nevertheless, it is wrong of the Linn Forum (Impartial as Linn always are) to allow him and his product to be slagged off. But it remains proof that if you do not sell your third party product through the biggest leach in audio land (Cymbiosis) you will be slagged off and abused.

    Because Russ does not sell through Peter Swain, he's doomed to be continually derided as Swain cannot make a bean out of him. Swain continually pushing Linn quality is wrong, purely on the basis that it is well known they turned out some shit plinths and sub chassis in the 1980's and it's taken them 30 years to get the LP12 performing better. Oh but hold on isn't Linn quality the best? Yea of course it is: tight main bearings, tight arm bearings, distorted plinths & chassis etc tends to demonstrate that Linn are really only interested in money.
    Last edited by John R; 29th May 2016 at 11:01.

  16. #56

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    Quote Originally Posted by John R View Post
    Thank for that Robert, I thought that may have been the case - Russ is an excellent craftsman, I know this first hand as he has built me a Lenco plinth.




    He certainly does Steve. Nevertheless, it is wrong of the Linn Forum (Impartial as Linn always are) to allow him and his product to be slagged off. But it remains proof that if you do not sell your third party product through the biggest leach in audio land (Cymbiosis) you will be slagged off and abused.

    Because Russ does not sell through Peter Swain, he's doomed to be continually derided as Swain cannot make a bean out of him. Swain continually pushing Linn quality is wrong, purely on the basis that it is well known they turned out some shit plinths and sub chassis in the 1980's and it's taken them 30 years to get the LP12 performing better. Oh but hold on isn't Linn quality the best? Yea of course it is: tight main bearings, tight arm bearings, distorted plinths & chassis etc tends to demonstrate that Linn are really only interested in money.
    perhaps the linn forum should be renamed as the Linn fanclub or it should carry a warning like on most chocolate bars:-may contain nuts!
    another thing I have found odd and often been slightly amused by is the way lp12 owners buy an lp12,which is supposed to be a precision made product,which seems to be then disassembled by the selling dealer,some parts are then bent/distorted(top plate) and then re assembled by the dealer using a large variety (bag full) of very precisely made springs/washers/nuts in a variety of combinations to then get it to bounce/perform correctly and play the tune:-if it and it's components are so precise surely all that malarkey shouldn't be needed?
    Last edited by steve195527; 29th May 2016 at 10:55.

  17. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by steve195527 View Post
    perhaps the linn forum should be renamed as the Linn fanclub or it should carry a warning like on most chocolate bars:-may contain nuts!
    another thing I have found odd and often been slightly amused by is the way lp12 owners buy an lp12,which is supposed to be a precision made product,which seems to be then disassembled by the selling dealer,some parts are then bent/distorted(top plate) and then re assembled by the dealer using a large variety (bag full) of very precisely made springs/washers/nuts in a variety of combinations to then get it to bounce/perform correctly and play the tune:-if it and it's components are so precise surely all that malarkey shouldn't be needed?

    Spot on Steve..!

    Ha! "Play the tune" really creases me up, a bloody Dansette plays the tune along with a barrage of distortion, wow and pitch instability! It's the myth perpetuated by a couple of their parasitic dealers.

    I wish to be clear that not all Linn dealers are thus, I know and have dealt with quite a few, but Cymbiosis closely followed by What You See and Hear clearly are abject leaches and I personally wouldn't touch them with a bargepole.

  18. #58
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    Give it a rest guys. There's already a Linn-bashing thread and I'm fed up with reading it. Not all folk are interested in Linn and their business ethos.

  19. #59
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    Sorry Gary, but this is my paid for window on the truth and they are going to continue to get it until I retire from this business.


    I don't force anyone to read it or pass comment, but if they wish to it's here for them to indulge.


    Regards.

    John.
    Last edited by John R; 29th May 2016 at 13:41.

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    It's personal (and probably true) views expressed on a forum . As long as there is no reason for litigation or profanity then it's ok.

    Chill peeps.

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