Tangerine Audio is about to launch their Skorpion base plate in a couple of days. It is machined from a solid billet of aluminium and has many features in common with their Karmen top plate and Plateau sub chassis. It has principally been designed with their flagship Stiletto in mind and it includes machined feets to.
And the LFC is as usually not happy with an 3rd party nice piece of work
But of course its on my must have list.
Last edited by SME V; 20th March 2017 at 19:37. Reason: my bad english, but still better than your swedish :)
one reason for making and selling after market products is, as remembered by Sir Isaac Newton: 'standing on the shoulders of giants'. All the marketing and selling has been done, all that is necessary is to get your name known (and associated with the 'giants').
I question if aluminium is the best material in this case, my base plates (for Lenco's) have been either resinated bamboo or seven layer laminates. Needs to be really damping, especially if the turntable/plinth is not.
I think 'voiced' is right! Steve.
Tin Machine might even sound half decent (but highly unlikely).
In this case the mashined aluminium baseboard is made to be ONE piece with the plinth and get the damping in the feets, itīs mounted to the plinth with 10 pieces of hexagon M 3x12.
Mark had in this case do what he loves and belives, that the machined alu baseboard made the TT sounds better. And in his opinion it is. Mine comes later
This is to rise the performance of the TA Stiletto, not the originally fruitbox...
Last edited by SME V; 22nd March 2017 at 21:08.
I was doing some measurements today, looking at vibrations in materials (as I do) and decided to look at some aluminium I'm going to use for super tweeter 'boxes'. The test piece was anodised on one side, and had a scratch-resistant plastic layer on the other. Even so, once in resonance, it vibrated for some time. The numbers on the top axis are whole seconds.
I don't think even a pair of size 12 feet would damp that bit of aluminium, let alone a plinth bottom.
Thank you for a nice advice
This aluminum piece is not taken from the basement directly as you might imagine it is machined and made of 12 mm aluminum and it's stressed and ribbed to take away the vibrations and is also that I wrote that it is made so that it becomes one piece with the plinth so vibrations continues down into the feets if there is any ! and taken up by rubbers in those who are also made of aluminum.
I do not intend to use this feets, I will use spikes so that any vibrations go down into the substrate under the turntable, which means that my furniture will take up any vibrations that becomes. But of course il will test both of them.
The old bases was only there for protection that you dont get a chock from electrics in the turntable and was not an intension to give the turntable any performance at all, il do had some Linns and tested without the base board and in these days it was more like a drum skin and that was the case.
Now itīs made for the TT and itīs made so this is a part of the whole performance so why let it alone.
remedial action can (and has to be) taken to attempt to diminish the real possibility of vibrations in panels of aluminium, and steel and carbon fibre RP, glass fibre RP, and titanium. The effectiveness will, no doubt, depend on individual applications, but in all of them, I would suggest, there is always vibrations.
SME V brings up an almost universal misconception, that vibrations somehow find their way through structures like water through the topology of the countryside. They do not. Vibrations cannot be led away to their death somewhere else, like sheep. A panel, like a plinth base, will vibrate, regardless of any action taken to stop it. All we can do, at best, is reduce the vibrations to a level where they are no longer a problem, or let them colour the final sound.
A panel vibrates up and down (and from side to side). The whole panel vibrates, with some areas vibrating more than others, depending on the modes of vibration. If you put spikes under a panel, some of those vibrations will be transferred to the support, and depending on the support material and frequencies involved, some vibrational amplitudes will be amplified to quite high levels, depending on the transmissibility of the materials involved. And don't forget that spikes are two way, whatever the turntable is placed on will transmit vibrations to the turntable.
What's wrong with thick ply or mdf, which has been sealed so it lasts a long time? It sounds warmer doesn't it.
They 'sound' warmer (?) because they also vibrate quite a bit. Ply and mdf are used in hifi structures because they are cheap and easier to machine than alternatives. They also have very poor intrinsic damping. Even the BBC, who specified ply in their loudspeaker construction went for thin walls, to be damped by bitumen panels, because the thicker ply could not be damped enough!
Do I let it colour the final sound or i donīt, itīs a decision i have to make at a high cost or zero cost.
The whole world vibrates, nothing i can do about that so i donīt put my time on that and Mark on TA says it will perform better than the Tramp 2 then I belive it does.
I do have an Super Oak TT in my life all in Mdf even the platter, it burnt good in the fire place and warm me up a couple of seconds
well, there is something you can do about it.
But if Mark says it will perform, then it must be true, and I've been wasting my time, money and understanding for the last ten years.
Here's another scan of an aluminium structure, it's an aluminium pultrusion, 150mm cube. It has significant vibrations, and signs of ringing (the wavelike modulation). I am going to use it for tweeter boxes, but I will need to damp the structure significantly before using it.
Here is the FFT of the above, giving some idea of the frequencies involved.
Last edited by cat's squirrel; 23rd March 2017 at 14:56.
Then with suspended designs adding mass can cause issues by moving resonances below the resonant frequency of the suspension,which most have difficulty dealing with,hence linn wanting the LP12 place on a light coffee table type support to keep the resonances in the support in the frequency band it can best cope with
What we all tend to forget at time is that any hifi system is a compromise(and I do mean any and all)what we have to aim for is a compromise that we ourselves can live with and afford
No confusion here. As you state, for the same input force, the higher the mass, the lower the acceleration (amplitude of the vibrations) but the energy remains the same. As the mass is likely to have very little damping, amplitudes will build quite quickly, and the mass effect will be negated.
There is an idea that mass, stiffness and damping (the three important parameters we are talking about) can be represented by electrical analogues, damping by resistance, compliance (1/stiffness) by capacitance and mass by inductance. It is possible to build electrical circuits which represent the mass, stiffness and damping of a system. But, earth, although present in the analogue (electrical) circuits, has no mechanical equivalent. Therefore, is a mechanical earth even possible? It is not a mass, as that is an inductance!